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Post by terp on Oct 11, 2004 19:13:17 GMT -5
donnie's pills being placebos basically prove that frank the br was supernatural. he was not a hallucination. he was able to appear only to donnie, and also appear in the mirror. that's pretty supernatural. we don't really see anything else that frank the br does, because he is in a way not really there. but he does guide donnie, push and mold him toward what donnie must do. he posesses donnie in a way, and 'makes' him flood the school and burn down the house. hence "they made me do it" and when he asks frank "why did you make me flood the school?" that kinda sucked lol... boys? The pills wouldn't make Donny a schizo, they would suppress it. If you have a cold and you take placebos instead of medicine, you will continue to be sick. You don't think seeing a 6 foot tall rabbit in the mirror telling you to burn down houses and flood schools is the sign of someone who 'Forgot to take their pills'?
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Post by rightfielder21 on Oct 11, 2004 19:18:19 GMT -5
The point was Donnie wasn't mentally ill...
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Post by terp on Oct 11, 2004 19:21:17 GMT -5
donnie's pills being placebos basically prove that frank the br was supernatural. he was not a hallucination. he was able to appear only to donnie, and also appear in the mirror. that's pretty supernatural. we don't really see anything else that frank the br does, because he is in a way not really there. but he does guide donnie, push and mold him toward what donnie must do. he posesses donnie in a way, and 'makes' him flood the school and burn down the house. hence "they made me do it" and when he asks frank "why did you make me flood the school?" that kinda sucked lol... boys? Donnie's doctor is experimenting with his medication. She's seeing how he will respond to placebo. This is fairly common. I think you're assuming that him being on placebo means he was never a schizo. I disagree. Read my theory on the plot. Donnie being on placebo rather than his real meds is what sparks his behavior in the TU. Which, as you stated earlier, is the cause of the artifact moving from dimension to dimension.
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Post by terp on Oct 11, 2004 19:23:39 GMT -5
The point was Donnie wasn't mentally ill... Whose point was that? You don't think that mentally ill people are given placebos? I think his learning that he was being given placebo was meant to cast doubt in his own mind about what he'd been seeing. Not to absolve him of all mental illness.
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Post by gretchen on Oct 11, 2004 19:24:51 GMT -5
uhhmmm... ha... i'm so tired right now i can't even really process this correctly. i think terp's theory is an interesting idea. but i don't think it supports what we read in the POTT. thanks RF for that elaboration and link to the POTT.
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Post by terp on Oct 11, 2004 19:28:01 GMT -5
uhhmmm... ha... i'm so tired right now i can't even really process this correctly. i think terp's theory is an interesting idea. but i don't think it supports what we read in the POTT. thanks RF for that elaboration and link to the POTT. What does the POTT say that bucks my theory?
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Post by Twitchmonkey on Oct 11, 2004 19:28:06 GMT -5
uhhmmm... ha... i'm so tired right now i can't even really process this correctly. i think terp's theory is an interesting idea. but i don't think it supports what we read in the POTT. thanks RF for that elaboration and link to the POTT. Well I've always said that there are valid theories that dont fit in exactly with POTT....thats just Kellys views on what occured
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Post by ProvidencePortal on Oct 11, 2004 22:08:28 GMT -5
....thats just Kellys views on what occured Huh? I'm taken aback by the term "just" as a modifier suggesting minimal importance. Now, I know we regularly entertain theories that extend outside the bounds of the texts. That's a fun excercise and can lead to compelling ideas. But as the creator of the mythos, I guess I've always believed Kelly's view trumps any other postulated ideas. After all, it's his story, his universe. They're his characters and conflicts. If any one knows what something's "supposed" to mean, it's Kelly.
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Post by Buu on Oct 12, 2004 17:58:11 GMT -5
The events that Frank guides Donnie to are what Donnie was meant to do in the Primary Universe or real world, If he doesn't get killed by the engine. This is supported by his destiny spear/fluid leading him to the gun.
Had Donny awoken and avoided the engine, his schizofrenic nature (In one deleted scene, we learn that Donnie has recently been taken off medication and placed on placebo) would've caused him to flood the school, either out of spite for the school or to spend more time with Gretchen; burn down Cunningham's house out of spite, and shoot Frank out of anger after he hit Gretchen. These actions lead donny to send the engine of his mom and sis's plane thru the portal as we see in the movie. He's actually sending the engine to Oct. 2 to kill himself to avoid all the events he's just seen (Death of Gretchen, murder of Frank). By doing this he creates an "artifact", because the engine he sends thru doesn't belong where he's sending it. He has either sent the engine to a tangent universe or created a tangent universe when he sent the engine thru. This tangent universe places all reality at risk. (Donnie had to have actually done all these things of his own "free will" at some point)
When the engine arrives in the tangent universe, it would kill Donnie and he could never fix the problem that the engine's presence creates. The manipulated body of Frank (Who has already been killed by Donnie in the real universe) is sent to help Tangent Donnie escape death and perform all the tasks listed above so that he can send a "replacement" engine back to the real universe.
The world that most of the movie takes place in contains one too many engines (Because real Donnie sent it there). By sending an engine from the tangent universe (Oct. 30) into the real universe(Oct 2.) he balances things out. Since the universe is no longer compromised by an artifact (The engine that kills him is from the tangent universe, the engine from the real universe has perished with the tangent universe and was replaced by the tangent engine) Donnie isn't needed to restore order and so he's free to die and avoid the pain he would bring to Frank, Gretchen, and his family.
The engine that hits him in the end, is the same engine we see him send thru the portal.
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Post by gretchen on Oct 12, 2004 18:02:51 GMT -5
ummmm buu.... you posted this at least twice.
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Post by Buu on Oct 12, 2004 19:35:49 GMT -5
ummmm buu.... you posted this at least twice. My posts would just get responses in each thread, get ignored in all but a couple, or just ignored all together. If anything is cluttering the board, it's you yapping in every thread I posted it in.
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Reed
Junior Member
Posts: 69
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Post by Reed on Nov 6, 2004 21:50:38 GMT -5
Ok....now to the meaning. This is the premise (and its pretty basic). Every person in this world functions according to a path assigned them by God (Yes, there are overt religious overtones). Straying from this path may sometimes be possible in two ways. The first is that wormholes or portals in the fabric of space-time may allow someone to go back to a past that he already have knowlege of and thus change it. This is incredibly rare, but possible. The second is that a more common rift in space-time allows someone to see into the future and thus chose not to follow his preordained path. (Reference the conversation between the physics teacher and Donnie....it is the most important in the film). So, in the film, one or the other of these two things has happened. (or both) So what happens is that Donnie sees what happens if he does not follow his preordained path, and how the forces of nature (or God) all work to set him back to that path. These forces are very overt in Frank and Gretchen, but are present in each character in the film in some way or another. Even the school punks have a part to play. So whether Donnie actually got up and got out of bed the night he was ordained to die, or he just got a vision of what would happen if he did get out of bed does not matter. What he realizes at the end (and the reason he is laughing) is that he must follow God's plan, but that the fact that there is a God and there is a plan for him means that he is not in fact alone. So, that is the basic premise, or ruleset, of the film. Once your there, your on your way to figure out what actually happens. I would suggest figuring it out on your own since its more fun, but if you want spoilers and clues, check out my Clues post. Good Luck. Damn... you're good.
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