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Post by ProvidencePortal on Mar 1, 2005 14:19:20 GMT -5
If I had to choose between someone trolling for pity and someone just being out-and-out shitty, I'd pick shitty. Sniveling heartstrings stuff is unkind to people who AREN'T assholes before they start talking about their problems.
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Post by 16brian160 on Mar 2, 2005 17:27:02 GMT -5
Here is my 2 cents.
The plane engine came from the future (Oct 30). This is when the engine should have fallen onto Donnie's house. It fell on the house in the past (Oct. 2) causing the tangental universe.
What I do not understand is if you accept the above facts then when Donnie returns the engine to the primary universe to save the world then he should have returned it to Oct. 30 (its proper place in time) not Oct 2 as the film shows. We should have seen Donnie's father asleep in the chair, the sister coming home and Donnie in bed laughing without being killed since the engine will now fall when it was supposed to fall on Oct. 30.
If the engine fell on Donnie on Oct. 2 as it did at the end of the film another tangental universe would have been started since the engine should fall on Oct. 30 not Oct. 2 and this time Donnie would not be around to save the universe.
If Donnie does return the engine to Oct. 30 then the same events could take place (flooding, burning of house etc.), but probably would not since they were manipulated events. Donnie may still die as a result of the engine falling provided he is in bed at the right time on Oct. 30. If Donnie restores the primary universe timeline then probably the only person to die would be his little sister who would still most likely be on the plane that loses the engine.
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Post by Wild on Mar 13, 2005 5:07:56 GMT -5
You should go back and read the POTT again. The answer is right there in this line:
Divine intervention is deemed the only logical conclusion for the appearance for the Artifact.
There you go. GOD sent the original engine down and caused all the corruption. WHY? The movie tells you: Donnie was lost in the dark, looking for god. This is how God showed Donnie the Light.
Hence the name, Donnie DARKO.
After Donnie saves the world and his girlfriend, the engine lands on him and he dies because now that he has found God he's completed his mission. He was doomed (as his father said afterwards, when talking about a friend who died after saying they were doomed and then how someone said Donnie was doomed and then he died), but before he dies, God saves him.
It's a story about enlightenment.
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Post by Pyramid Head on Mar 13, 2005 10:16:46 GMT -5
Here's where I'm confused. The Roberta Sparrow book, as well as Richard Kelly, often say that the engine needs to be "returned back" to the Primary Universe, which means that's where it came from to begin with. But this doesn't seem possible, since the only thing that caused it to appear was Donnie sending it back in time from his mother's plane, a scenario which does not occur in the Primary Universe. So how can this be?
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Post by Bigboy on Mar 13, 2005 16:17:31 GMT -5
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Post by Shakesbeer on Mar 13, 2005 20:54:04 GMT -5
I think everyone should re-read christophers explaination. it's completely logical.
The reason the TU was created was because the engine came from NOWHERE. This breaks all the rules of the Universe. If the LAWS of the universe are broken, the universe itself will come to an end. So Donnie has to find another engine and send it back via a wormhole to un-break the laws of the universe. In doing this, the laws will remain intact and the world will not end.
I don't think you can use the word "future" because it isn't the future, its a tangant universe. It's a linear time sequence not a loop. Not really sure how to explain that though. Anywho, what an awesome movie and I love hearing everyone's questions and theories.
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Post by Bigboy on Mar 13, 2005 22:41:58 GMT -5
And if you read the thread I suggested you will find that on the whole the ideas expressed there agree with that, but actually go further to try to explain how.
Also, he actually contradicts himself on this very point:
i.e. Corruption-->Engine
i.e. Engine-->Corruption
I have already stated further inconsistencies in my reply to his post.
When we refer to the 'future' as in 'future scientists' we are referring to the future of the PU.
If the word 'future' is used to describe the engine then I agree with you - events in the movie are totally linear (no loop), and nothing travels in time - just between PU and TU.
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Post by Shakesbeer on Mar 13, 2005 23:03:47 GMT -5
Yeah i didnt really think of that contradiction. It's a case of what came first the chicken or the egg. Was the corruption of space-time caused by the engine existing or did the engine exist because of the corruption of the space-time. Good point big.
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Post by PyramidHead on Mar 13, 2005 23:34:23 GMT -5
During the commentary on the new Director's Cut DVD, Richard Kelly says something like "I had this idea that the jet engine falls on Donnie's house at the beginning...but from where? And then I decided: it was from his mother's plane in the future." This, if I remember it correctly, mucks the whole thing up. But I could be mis-remembering -understanding -repeating -whatever, so someone with more time might want to factcheck me on that.
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Post by ProvidencePortal on Mar 14, 2005 9:06:14 GMT -5
Divine intervention is deemed the only logical conclusion for the appearance for the Artifact. There you go. GOD sent the original engine down and caused all the corruption. Right -- except that the quote you selected from the PoTT describes how the people who witness parts of the Living Receiver cycle perceive it ... it's not stating the actual cause of its appearance. "Divine intervention is deemed the only logiclal conclusion" by the people who see the arrival of the artifact -- because of its mysterious and seemingly cause-less appearance, the only "logical" explanation is that it's divine. That aside, I do think there is plenty of evidence to suggest that this movie documents Donnie's journey of enlightenment; plenty of discussion around the board on that every subject. |
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Post by gretchen on Mar 14, 2005 9:31:01 GMT -5
shakes, the TU is not created due to the engine.
the POTT clearly states that TUs occur spontaneously of their own agenda.
the reason the engine is such a big deal is because it came from the PU into the TU. now the universes are unbalanced, and the TU will take the PU with it when it collapses.
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Post by shakesbeer on Mar 14, 2005 21:25:52 GMT -5
What makes the universes unbalanced? Wouldn't having the engines in both the universes create balance? I guess i'm assuming the reason the TU was created was because of the engine. If not, why does he have to send it back. The only reason i can come up with is that by sending it back legitimizes it's existance because it came from SOMEWHERE even if it is a tangant Universe. I just ran 3 miles after a long day of work so sorry if i'm being stupid  |
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Post by gretchen on Mar 14, 2005 21:47:35 GMT -5
the engine comes from the PU.
when it is deposited in the TU, that makes one extra engine in the TU.
are you following?
the TU is basically a short term replica of the PU. but now it has one extra item than the PU. rendering them unbalanced.
the reason donnie needs to send the engine (or more specifically, it's TU replica) back into the PU is that the two universes must be balanced at the time the Tu collapses or else it will take the PU and all life with it.
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Post by DonnieDarkoRules on Mar 16, 2005 21:25:56 GMT -5
I got the Donnie Darko book and it explains alot. Its something about the Manipulated dead (Frank) trying to contact the Manipulated living (Donnie) it does explain alot, these pages are what i thought i understood from the Roberta Sparrow book, but i'm sure somebody will prove me wrong OK. I understand all of the movie except one thing: if Frank is the manipulated dead, how can he drive the car & kill whatshername (the name has slipped my mind). |
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Post by DonnieDarkoRules on Mar 16, 2005 21:47:35 GMT -5
OK. For all you people who don't like/understand the idea of a tangent universe, here's the "single-universe" theory I created. Sad that you may learn something from a 13-year-old boy.
So, basically, start the movie after the engine falls (there is no engine). Donnie continues on (Frank is there), and does all the events (flooding of the school, burning of the house, the kiddie porn dungeon, etc). Then Frank opens up a hole in the sky. Donnie creates a wormhole that situates directly on one of the engines of the plane that Donnie's sister & mother are in, turning EVERYTHING back in time, EXCEPT the engine (well, it does go back in time but it doesn't go back WITH the plane as it should). So, the engine is in the air, everything else is as it was at the beginning of the movie, except Donnie is in his bed laughing. The FAA will be a little concerned when one of their planes' jet engines suddenly dissappears from it (possibly in midflight, probably on the ground and it just dissaparates), and mysteriously crushes a kid that is extremely far away from it.
Ya theres a few loopholes (such as; why would they be in a hotel? [that doesnt really relate to it tho] and the whole october 2/30 thing. OH WELL!)
*sigh*
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