donnie darko theory

[Room101]

Well, i must say all of the things i read here are interesting and it is very nice to see the several interpratations. anyhow, i think that those attempts eventually lead to one unanswered questions or another. i mean, from my point of view, there is no exact combinations of the scenes and sentences that takes the puzzle to an exact story, and to "what leads to what, and why does certain things happend".
The biggest example for this will be the living Frank at the end of the period and the "hells know what" Frank troughout the movie. supposing the hole in his eye was from the shooting, and the "touching his healthy eye" scene indicates that something good has happend, it made me, as an audience, feel that Franks has succeded in something, that perhaps when he sais the time of the End of the world, he only means his worid, i.e - his life. and if this is the success then the mission was to make Donnie Not shooting him (which will not happen eventually because he is dead of course..)
But, ain't the shooting is only the final phase of the brainwashed by Frank Donnie tour? Frank is trying to make Donnie know about time travelling and to eventually do it so he will not do things that Frank made him do?
for those of you who are also a Lynch fans, i would like to compare this movie to "Lost Highway". if you recall one of the starting scene is a guy telling the lead actor somthing in the Intercom speaker. at the end of the movie tha lead actor IS that guy that say the sentence.
not like "Mulholland Drive" that fits amazingly to a nice built reallistic story, lost highway is a much more surealistic film with no strings to time or matter rules.
i do believe that Donnie Darko has also such qualities. not in the same way, Donnie Darko is much more attached to life and to emotions but there is a certain amount of unexplained behaviour of the happening.
which is ofcourse certanly acceptable.
i do think the movie is great, i do think there is more then i am saying now, and there is a chance i will find out all i am saying is a load of Banana's bull, and there is an exact explination of the entire movie.
Till that will happen,
Do enjoy;)

[IIVII]

My Theory: In order to truly understand this story you must understand (and analyze) this one quote. “I can only hope that the answers will come to me in my sleep. I hope that when the world comes to an end that I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to". This in not only a suicide not but also a summary of the events in the movie. “I can only hope that the answers will come to me in my sleep” This is referring to the Tangent universe. “I hope that when the world comes to an end that I can breathe a sigh of relief” You can see that Donnie is laughing in the dream before he is shown laughing after he wakes up, this is his sigh of relief). “there will be so much to look forward to" This is the reason why Donnie does not leave his bedroom after the dream. This shows that Donnie is ready to die. Consider that the world revolves around each and every one of us, in this case; the world does end (Donnie’s). While God (Frank) is showing Donnie all of these terrible things in his existence, Donnie is sort of being “God’s Hands”. He’s sending a message through his actions, and his message is delivered in everybody’s sleep. So, it’s sort of a “kill two birds with one stone” concept. There are a lot of things left out in the movie that the DVD truly helps you understand. If you look at the one deleted scene where Frank is telling Donnie that “God loves his children”, it proves that Frank is indeed god and is showing Donnie the path in which he must travel. In conclusion, I believe that Donnie knows exactly what is going to happen when he wakes up from his dream. He chooses to lie in bed; not because he doesn’t remember, or because he’s saving anybody, but because he’s ready to experience something else that this world cannot offer him. -MRRM

P.S. Donniedarko.com gives you the opportunity to simulate Donnie’s experience. You go throughout the website in levels (tests) and proceed to a higher level of understanding.

[IIVII]

I belive i understand this movie 100%. Please feel free to ask your questions on this post and I'll answer them. If for some reason I'm not replying send me an e-mail at [e-mail].

[DarkoFan]

First things first… my interpretation of this movie has changed a lot after seeing it so many times and after reading other people’s ideas on this site. While I like my interpretation of the story, I also understand that the writer/director purposefully leaves some things open to discussion and says as much in his commentary. Those few people who claim that this is not the case and only they understand 100% of the movie, implying that every one of the other people posting here are just plain wrong (although luckily they will do the unenlightened among us the favor of explaining it to us) seem to be the ones who are furthest from the mark but don’t realize this because they ignore any details in the movie that contradict their opinion.

IIVII… Regarding your interpretation of the quote “I can only hope that the answers will come to me in my sleep. I hope that when the world comes to an end that I can breathe a sigh of relief, because there will be so much to look forward to"… you state that this is a suicide, but that isn’t really even implied in that statement. You really have to read a lot of your own ideas into that sentence to come out with that interpretation. As far as the answers coming in his sleep being a reference to the tangent universe, that seems unlikely since he writes the letter while in the tangent universe. I also find it odd that you would interpret Donnie’s laughter as breathing a sigh of relief. My interpretation of the line “I hope that when the world comes to an end that I can breathe a sigh of relief” is that towards the end of the movie, Donnie is understanding more and more about what is happening to him. He realizes that the world really is ending, but only the tangent universe world. This means that when he has accomplished his task, his very traumatic experience will finally be over and he can go back to the primary universe along with everyone else and live his normal life (which although was not perfect, must seem ideal after the 28 days that he has had. Plus maybe he would be a little better off after having learned a lot about life and love and getting a little closer to his family, especially his mom). It does not surprise me that somebody who thinks they understand the movie 100% also thinks that the world revolves around him, but I think that interpreting the world ending as just Donnie’s death ignores a lot of other details in the movie. In addition, your “proof” that Frank is God is directly contradicted by the POTT indication that he is manipulated dead, just like Gretchen. While I think that he is being influenced by God, it’s a pretty big leap from there to the notion that he is God.

The first couple of times I saw DD I thought that Donnie had to sacrifice himself at the end to save everyone (like many others here). But after seeing the movie several more times I have come to think that maybe Donnie did not know he was going to die and did not have to die. This is supported by the POTT text about the receiver (and everyone else) waking up and thinking that the tangent universe was just a dream (that fades quickly). Also. in the director's commentary, Richard Kelley alludes to the idea that Donnie maybe just forgot to get out of bed. Further, there is no reason to think that his living would have caused all of the misery it did in the tangent universe. Remember that if it weren’t for Frank telling him to flood the school, burn down the house, etc. none of those events would have happened (might never have met Gretchen, Mom wouldn’t have been on the plane, etc.). It is entirely possible that Gretchen wouldn’t have even been interested in him. Don’t forget that she is being manipulated like everyone else to get Donnie to do what he needs to do. Finally, the thing that made me more sure that Donnie didn’t know he was going to die was a few postings back in this thread by DonnaDarko where she pointed out that Donnie rolled over and went back to sleep. If you knew that a jet engine was about to crush you to death, even if you were happy with the reasons you had to do it, would you (or even could you) just roll over and go to sleep?

[Pax]

Frank is not God. IVII, you cite the "God loves His children" quote as proof, but then leave out the next line, "And He loves you." Frank, if he were God, I suppose he could be talking about himself in the third person, but add to this contradiction what DarkoFan pointed out, that Frank is listed in Sparrow's book as a manipulated dead...I just don't think Frank is God. But if that's what you want to think, more power to you. The movie can hold up under just about any interpretation. Peace.

[IIVII]

Darko fan- I apologize if some of my comments seem “contradicting”. I thought I went into enough detail for all of you but I guess I didn’t. Let me explain it better for you. I said that the letter to Sparrow was a suicide note because he understands that this is a dream. I belive that he realizes that this is a “tangent universe”. Upon realizing this, he chooses to stay in his bed. Wouldn’t that be suicide? Of course it is. Because he sent that jet engine back to kill himself. It is implied in the statement as well. He realizes “there will be so much more to look forward to”. As for the writing the letter in his sleep, he realizes it’s a dream and it’s controllable, hence the jet engine. When you argue that frank is the manipulated dead like Gretchen I completely disagree. There is only one manipulated dead and that’s obviously frank (try rereading the pages of POTT, I’m not the contradicting one ). Gretchen is one of the manipulated living, just because she dies does not make her part of the manipulated dead. Why is it so hard to see Frank as god? When you watch the scenes with commentaries Richard Kelly mentions one main reason he took that out was because it no longer left frank’s being to the imagination. Your right about the waking up and not remembering part. It can be interpreted that way. But when you look at it hard enough the idea that he knew he was going to die and chose not to because “he has so much more to look forward to” makes a lot more sense. “There is no reason to think that his living would have caused all of the misery it did in the tangent universe”, I agree. I never said it would. I think you got your posts confused. “Would you (or even could you) just roll over and go to sleep?” If I knew that there was an after life and it would give me so much more then this world does, then yea; you bet your ass I would.

[IIVII]

For pax- I think I made the top reply clear enough for the both of you. If you don’t agree with me that’s cool. There’s nothing I like more then a debate; but please, share with us your take on the story. Why don’t you think Frank could possible be god (or spirit conveying messages for god)? Who knows, maybe dark mystic is right all along .

[DarkoFan]

IIVII... So your saying that if it is a given that Donnie sent the engine back to kill himself then didn't get out of bed that would be suicide. No duh! (... is a product of fear But you are assuming as facts the very parts of the movie that are most open to interpretation, such as whether or not Donnie chooses to stay in bed. That doesn’t make your interpretation invalid, but as much as you think it is 100% foolproof, other interpretations would seem to be at least as meaningful. However, I do still disagree with a few of your arguments. First, whether you want to interpret the movie as a dream (a la "Occurance at Owl Creek Bridge") or a science fiction/time travel story is very open to debate, but I question your interchanging of the two. If the movie is a dream then it does not have to follow the laws of reality. It does not have to end the way that it does since the tangent universe and the end of the world have a vastly different impact if it is all a dream (because that means that Donnie really isn’t saving anybody and he is going to wake up from it no matter what -- by the way, I disagree that if it is a dream it is controllable since dreams generally are not).

As far as the manipulated dead and the pages of POTT, you are either illiterate or ignoring evidence that doesn't support your theory since you will see in the link below that Gretchen and Frank are the two people listed as manipulated dead. By the way, the last paragraph of my previous post was just a summary of my thoughts about the end of the movie. It was not specifically a response to your post (sorry if that wasn't clear). Finally, to your last point, I’m not sure if you meant that to come across the way it did, but you make it sounds as if every Christian on the planet should be running out to commit suicide because they know that something better is waiting for them in the next world. And if you agree that Donnie didn’t have to die to save anyone but stayed in bed anyway (to find something better in the afterlife), you are arguing that Donnie dies at the end simply because he is suicidal. I know I’m not the only person who would have issues with that interpretation of the end of the movie.

ruinedeye.com/cd/time10.htm

[IIVII]

DarkoFan- First of all let’s get one thing clear, When I said I believe I understand the story 100%; I wasn’t implying that I’m better then anyone else on this board. So cut the flaming. All I’m saying is that I think I have a solid case for my theory. So don’t mock my comments. Are you debating that the tangent universe is not a dream? “If the movie is a dream then it does not have to follow the laws of reality”. So would you say that putting an axe through solid bronze, force fields and “liquid workers” are all things in reality? Hmm, interesting. Donnie goes through everything he does because it’s his destiny. He affects others through his dream because the characters included in his tangent universe (dream) follow him. That’s why they all wake up shocked at what they have just witnessed. He is saving people in his dream. He helps others along the way as he helps himself. As far as dreams being controllable, it’s been proven that they are. It’s even proven within the movie itself (but you have to consider that the tangent universe is a dream in the first place). I did read that Gretchen is supposedly one of the manipulated dead. But reading the page about the manipulated dead, she follows nothing of what is said about them. She’s not more powerful then the living receiver, she doesn’t contact Donnie through the fourth dimensional construct and she doesn’t set an insurance trap. She becomes one. Gretchen is merely a guide, to aid in Donnie’s path. Obviously, every Christian shouldn’t kill themselves. Donnie does it because he is ready for death. He no longer needs to live because he already did what he was meant to (even if it was just a dream) The manipulated living experienced the dream and it will change there lives forever(as shown on the Donnie darko website). If you think that Donnie isn’t ready to die consider this, why even send the jet engine back? The only logical explanation for sending it back is for him to die. I know I discuss a lot of religion in my theories and it’s not because I’m a religious freak (I am in fact agnostic), it’s because it is all throughout the movie. From the very first meeting with frank (deleted scene) to the conversations with his psychiatrist and his science teacher. It’s shown at the theatre with the “Last Temptation of Christ” being displayed. Religion has been argued to be involved in the film through hidden references. You cannot deny the impact religion has on this film. It’s all of these pieces of evidence I have drawn my theory. If there’s anything else you question just ask.

[DarkoFan]

IIVII... Whatever… “I belive i understand this movie 100%. Please feel free to ask your questions on this post and I'll answer them” is a flameworthy comment. After my one flame, I have just been trying to point out to you how there might possibly be interpretations of this movie that contradict yours but are at least as valid, so lighten up.
To answer your question of whether or not I am debating that the tangent universe is a dream, I am not. I believe that you could interpret the movie as a dream or as events that actually happened. My point is that applying any kind of meaning to the movie becomes a lot more difficult (if not impossible) if you use the two interpretations interchangeably.
In response to your question, “So would you say that putting an axe through solid bronze, force fields and “liquid workers” are all things in reality? Hmm, interesting.“ If my best friend comes to me today and says that he saved the world last night by traveling back in time I’m going to be pretty sure that he was just a dreaming. But don’t forget that this is a movie. If a character in a movie says the same thing I can accept that it is a representation of the movie’s reality (as incongruous as it may be with our reality - think about Ghostbusters or Terminator - just because unreal over the top stuff happens you don’t necessarily assume that it is all a dream). In DD I can accept that Donnie had super powers and saved the world or that he dreamed he had superpowers and dreamed he saved the world… but not both. If it is all a dream then it doesn’t really happen so Donnie just dreams that he saves the world, he doesn’t actually save the world.
In fact, if it is all a dream then he didn’t really send the engine back to the primary universe so he didn’t really commit suicide either. To answer your question, “If you think that Donnie isn’t ready to die consider this, why even send the jet engine back?” I think that it is pretty clear from the movie and the director’s comments that Donnie had to (or believed he had to) send the jet engine back to save the world (whether he is in a tangent universe or just dreaming he is in one). According to the POTT page on the tangent universe, ”Eventually it will collapse upon itself, forming a black hole within the Primary Universe capable of destroying all existence.”
I never denied the impact of religion on this film and I don’t think it’s anything specific to your theory. Richard Kelley comes out and explicitly says a major point of the movie was God’s intervening on our behalf to save us, so I guess I agree with you on that point. However, I still disagree with your conclusion that Donnie is suicidal or that people should kill themselves when they think they’ve accomplished their God-given mission in this life. I can buy the idea that he died inadvertently or that he sacrificed himself to save everyone (I think that covers the two main theories people have presented here) but not that he just wanted to end his life.

[IIVII]

I don't think I can make myself any more clearer for you. You keep misunderstanding me. My interpretation is that the tangent universe could be the dream, not the whole movie. My two main reasons to belive that the tangent universe is just a dream are: 1. There is no real sign that Donnie travels through a portal and goes through time.2. At the very end the cast is lying in there beds, as if they just woke up from a dream. Here are a couple other noteworthy things. Some belive that you can communicate to other people through dreams or a higher plane of consciousness ( i have a friend who is a budhist monk that swears by it). Another reason is that some say they can be real objects out of there dreams (the artifact). Aside from that, I'm not telling people to kill themselves! What donnie experienced was quite similar to that of jesus. That's a situation much different then waking up and saying "Well, I belive I did what I was here to do so i'm going to go off myself now". That sound's rediculous, and that's not what i'm implying at all. I don't know how you saw me comming off that way (especially since i've tried explaining it to you before). And as far as the flame worthy stuff goes, i' m just trying to let people who are really having trouble understanding what's going on know that i'm here to offer help if they want it. Damn man, you need to calm down.

[Peteypablo]

Right now, after reading them all, I'm gotta go with DarkoFan right now. I dont think he died to save Gretchen. If he was going to 'save Gretchen' he would just stay home at the Halloween Party.

[DarkoFan]

IIVII – I am not misunderstanding you. When you say that the tangent universe is a dream I am referring generally to the movie being a dream since all but 10 minutes of it takes place in the tangent universe. Regarding your two main reasons for believing this: 1. I don’t think that it is necessary to believe that Donnie travels back in time to think that the events of the tangent universe actually happened and were not a dream. It is only necessary that Donnie send the engine back in time. 2. Your point about everybody seeming to wake up from a dream at the end of the movie does a lot more to support the alternative theory that I have presented than it does yours. Richard Kelley devotes a whole section of POTT to Dreams and states that “When the Manipulated awakens from their Journey into the Tangent Universe, they are often haunted by the experience in their dreams.” He backs that up with something similar in his commentary on the DVD. I think that he lays out pretty specifically that if the events of the tangent universe really happened (and were not a dream) then people would wake up thinking it had been a dream. If you choose to ignore what the writer/director had to say on that subject in favor of your Buddhist friend, more power to you, but I disagree with you.

Regarding your last statement sounding ridiculous, those are your words, not mine. But on this point I admit to being confused. You ask how I can think that you are saying "Well, I belive I did what I was here to do so i'm going to go off myself now." I got that idea from your first post where you state “In conclusion, I believe that Donnie knows exactly what is going to happen when he wakes up from his dream. He chooses to lie in bed; not because he doesn’t remember, or because he’s saving anybody, but because he’s ready to experience something else that this world cannot offer him.” Followed by “Obviously, every Christian shouldn’t kill themselves. Donnie does it because he is ready for death. He no longer needs to live because he already did what he was meant to (even if it was just a dream)” So it’s clear that Donnie kills himself on purpose (you refer to it as suicide more than once) not to save anybody but “because he already did what he was meant to” and to “experience something else that this world cannot offer him.” How exactly is that different from “Well, I belive I did what I was here to do so i'm going to go off myself now."? Finally, I am open to the idea of DD as a Christ-like figure, but that would seem to necessitate that he died to save others. Since you state that Donnie did not die to save anybody, I don’t see how you can draw a parallel between the two (unless you are arguing that Christ did not die to save anybody, but that’s a debate you probably don’t want to start on this website).

[IIVII]

Jesus man. Your not understanding anything i'm saying. I'm convinced your writing back just to argue with me. I could say the world is round and you still wouldn't understand and then continue to dissagree with me! ;D. Look man, i'm gonna break my theory down for you one last time. Not that i don't want to answer questions, but i'm almost repeating myself with you. It's not only necessary for donnie to bring the engine back but to also change people's lives. The ultimate goal for him here is to be enlightened and move towards his destiny. Saying that you think youve done everything youve done with your life and killing yourself comaperd to actually seeing god (or angel, whatever floats your boat) is a completely different story. So to make this one step clearer; donnie saves people, but he doesnt have to die because of that. If he were to live, he still would have saved those people. The reason he dies is because he's ready to move on to the after life. I can understand how this can be confusing (because none of us can possibly relate to this), but, i can't explain it any deeper then that. If you still don't understand after this post you probably won't ever understand it. As for as the writer goes, you have to take his words with a grain of salt. Kelly never gives a definate answer on the ending, he just gives you a theory to think about. Consider that maybe i'm not ignoring the write but that your looking to into his words to much. If richard kelly was to say i'm right, would you quit analyzing my theory so much? Check out this link. www.revolutionsf.com/article.html?id=624&page=2
He says he belives more in my theory of the end then just waking up and going back to sleep. But it doesn't even matter if he says that or not, there will never be a true answer to the ending of this movie. Even darkmystic could be right.

[IIVII]

P.S. i hope you like my sig Dfan, i put it on there just for you.