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Post by insurgente on Dec 29, 2003 20:23:36 GMT -5
hey, just registered after browsing around; some amazing stuff...this is inspiring discussion for me. just wanted to get some queries down before i forget them (much like dreams/time travel ;D)
so, the website has an obituary for jim Cunningham dying a few days after Donnie Darko (right? i cant be arsed goin thru the website right now). i'm wondering why we see him looking depressed at the end of the film and then subsequently killing himself...
Surely after the tangent universe is closed, Donnie never burns his house down and so his kiddy porn dungeon is never discovered (there's no mention of his fetish on the website). Perhaps i'm being short sighted here; like this massive guilt after being discovered prompts his suicide. I spose he could just feel generally guilty about it, but in that enough reason? surely he cant be suicidal about donnie dying either...
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Post by duncan on Dec 29, 2003 22:57:23 GMT -5
I think this was mentioned in one of the interviews about the movie, where it's pointed out, that all the persons we see during the "Mad World" scene can remember the happenings from the tangent universe, basically like when you wake up after a dream and can remember its details.
That's surely why Jim Cunningham ended his life and destroyed/got rid of all evidence on the childporn matter.
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Post by insurgente on Dec 30, 2003 21:31:17 GMT -5
do we know the cunningham destroyed all that stuff?
somehow donnie dying inspired him to reevaluate his life and end it perhaps?
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Post by duncan on Dec 31, 2003 0:01:12 GMT -5
do we know the cunningham destroyed all that stuff? If I'm not mistaken, then the newspaper article mentioned that a hidden, but empty room was found in his estate. |
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Post by darkofan23 on Jan 12, 2004 23:26:49 GMT -5
Here is my theory, everyone involved in the tangent universe had the exact same "vision" as Donnie, thats the reason for everyone being sad in the end and the reason for frank rubbing his shot eye while crying, I believe that seeing this showed cunningham that he would get caught and he was crying \because he saw what would happen to him if he was caught.
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Post by Pax on Jan 12, 2004 23:35:50 GMT -5
DarkoFan23, that's an interesting idea, that everyone somehow saw what Donnie saw. My question is, I think ultimately just an observation about the film, i.e. Kelley and the Time Travel book mentions that people in the Tangent act in bizarre ways, etc. But really, it seems that the only person acting in an odd way is Donnie. Everyone else seems normal, more or less. Perhaps this is one of the ways in which the film can be seen as the delusions of a mentally disturbed teen. Just thought I'd throw this out there. Peace.
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Post by darkofan23 on Jan 13, 2004 0:06:04 GMT -5
Hmm, well after thinkin about it for a while i thought, maybe everyone who had an important part in the tangent universe, such as frank, gretchin, cunningham, and his mom all had the "vision" of the tangent universe, as said in a different post this is also my theory on the strange gazes given by gretchin and Mrs.Darko at the end of the movie, like they seem familour (sorry for spelling  ) but they cant work out the details like names. Also to be more on subject to the topic title, maybe seeing in how fans such as the teacher and people all over middlesex beleived in him so strongly that it just made him feel so guilty because of letting all those people down. |
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Post by Pax on Jan 13, 2004 12:54:28 GMT -5
Right. Maybe just the whole idea that they are there to guide the Living Receiver is the "bizarre" aspect. I don't know, as much as I love this movie, maybe more could have been done to develop this idea, to make the other characters act more strangely. Then again, we never really see them as they are for very long in the real universe, so maybe they did act unlike themselves in the Tangent. But that discounts Jim Cunningham, because he evidentely was a child pornographer in both realities. Hell, whatever.  |
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Post by Frenzal on Jan 13, 2004 20:22:35 GMT -5
Only Donnie can remember what happened in the tangent universe according to The Philosophy of Time Travel since he is the Living Receiver. The book also says that the manipulated living and manipulated dead which were close to the living receiver have indications of what happened in the tangent universe although they cannot remember details. That's why Gretchen and Rose wave to each other, Frank rubs his eye etc.
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Post by Chris T on Jan 15, 2004 3:29:44 GMT -5
First of all... it basically says in in the philosophy of time travel that the after-effects of the portal closing are like the existence of the artifact in the real universe and that dreams are an important part of time travel philosophy, (the living recievers dreams, and the manipulated living's dreams afterward) and that some may be clearer than others.
As for Cunninghams suicide let me just say that the website, however cool and intense, is just full of information that helps fill gaps in the storyline that are a little confusing. There are one or two basic major plot themes and can be found if you have a solid understanding of the storyline and the "rules" of the movie. So if you are actually trying to come away with something deep and applicable about life then use the website as a tool for a clearer understanding...
However, if you are just reading the website as proof of the complexity of the movie you watched, then I suggest that you stop trying to answer the little extra scraps of information on the movie and go deeper... and into the meat of info that we should all utilize everyday.
That being said, I wondered why Cunningham decided to take his own life after getting off scott free and this is what I came up with.
*I noticed in the movie that the Fear/Love movement is similar to certain forms of christianity. Now, certain characters follow this movement religiously. They immediately convince themselves that it is right and say they will live their lives morally and with family values. I can think of two characters this applies to. Mrs. Farmer lectures her students, Donnie, and Rose Darko on the importance of family values... BUT she is the dance instructor who luridly exploits young girls by teaching provactive dance in ostentatious uniforms. This is the less ironic of the two pro-Fear/Love characters.
The other Fear/Love character is of course Jim Cunningham. He is responsible for bringing this movement to the town so he could symbolize immorality among clergymen. Anyway He preaches of fear prone teens who give in to fear and attempts to sell this idea to the town. Heres where this all comes from... If Jim Cunningham, the biggest supporter of Fear/Love is the ringleader of a kiddie porn dungeon, That means he probably never listened to the message, HIS message of Fear/Love. He did not ever listen to the way we should live our lives.
The two characters who contrast to Jim and mrs Farmer are of course Donnie and Rose. Rose battles with mrs farmer a couple of times, but gives up after mrs farmer drags out family values. Rose does not accept Fear/Love right away and like so many Christians who have doubts, is alienated by the people who say they want to help. Also there is Donnie who blatently has doubts about the Fear/Love system. He says some things that people think are immoral and suddenly he is "troubled". At the end of the movie, Donnie sacrifices his life to save others, which proves to be the most well moralled act in the entire story. Basically the ones who have doubts are actually immoral and the characters who dont have doubts, and immediately accept something without contemplation are doing it out of fear and are overall the immoral people.
*Interesting Idea*
Towards the end, Donnie kills Frank..obviously a sin. But he did it out of love, and 'according to Jim' morality comes from not living in fear, but in love. Possibly an act of fear could be considered the more Moral thing to do.
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Post by Chris T on Jan 15, 2004 3:33:27 GMT -5
First of all... it basically says in in the philosophy of time travel that the after-effects of the portal closing are like the existence of the artifact in the real universe and that dreams are an important part of time travel philosophy, (the living recievers dreams, and the manipulated living's dreams afterward) and that some may be clearer than others.
As for Cunninghams suicide let me just say that the website, however cool and intense, is just full of information that helps fill gaps in the storyline that are a little confusing. There are one or two basic major plot themes and can be found if you have a solid understanding of the storyline and the "rules" of the movie. So if you are actually trying to come away with something deep and applicable about life then use the website as a tool for a clearer understanding...
However, if you are just reading the website as proof of the complexity of the movie you watched, then I suggest that you stop trying to answer the little extra scraps of information on the movie and go deeper... and into the meat of info that we should all utilize everyday.
That being said, I wondered why Cunningham decided to take his own life after getting off scott free and this is what I came up with.
*I noticed in the movie that the Fear/Love movement is similar to certain forms of christianity. Now, certain characters follow this movement religiously. They immediately convince themselves that it is right and say they will live their lives morally and with family values. I can think of two characters this applies to. Mrs. Farmer lectures her students, Donnie, and Rose Darko on the importance of family values... BUT she is the dance instructor who luridly exploits young girls by teaching provactive dance in ostentatious uniforms. This is the less ironic of the two pro-Fear/Love characters.
The other Fear/Love character is of course Jim Cunningham. He is responsible for bringing this movement to the town so he could symbolize immorality among clergymen. Anyway He preaches of fear prone teens who give in to fear and attempts to sell this idea to the town. Heres where this all comes from... If Jim Cunningham, the biggest supporter of Fear/Love is the ringleader of a kiddie porn dungeon, That means he probably never listened to the message, HIS message of Fear/Love. He did not ever listen to the way we should live our lives.
The two characters who contrast to Jim and mrs Farmer are of course Donnie and Rose. Rose battles with mrs farmer a couple of times, but gives up after mrs farmer drags out family values. Rose does not accept Fear/Love right away and like so many Christians who have doubts, is alienated by the people who say they want to help. Also there is Donnie who blatently has doubts about the Fear/Love system. He says some things that people think are immoral and suddenly he is "troubled". At the end of the movie, Donnie sacrifices his life to save others, which proves to be the most well moralled act in the entire story. Basically the ones who have doubts are actually moral and the characters who dont have doubts, and immediately accept something without contemplation are doing it out of fear and are overall the immoral people.
*Interesting Idea*
Towards the end, Donnie kills Frank..obviously a sin. But he did it out of love, and 'according to Jim' morality comes from not living in fear, but in love. Possibly an act of fear could be considered the more Moral thing to do.
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Post by Chris T on Jan 15, 2004 3:36:54 GMT -5
yeah, so, sorry about posting that twice. Total accident. But hopefully someone will understand it better reading it a second time.
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Post by Chris T on Jan 15, 2004 3:58:10 GMT -5
Wow, in all that crap I neglected to answer the one question I wanted. I think Jim Cunningham shot himself because he is immoral. He knows he could never do the right thing and change his life. He was so caught up in the Fear/Love that when he realized what could have happened, he subconsciously sees what a slimeball he was compared to Donnie. And being that he IS a slimeball, it was fitting for him to commit one more act of fear by covering his tracks, taking his own life and leaving his name in good graces with the community that he exploited.
*Fun Fact*
For all you members with the DVD, watch the cunning vision infomercials on the special features. Pay close attention to when Jim gives the bedwetter a hug, and you'll see a quick gesture that foreshadows Jims pedophilic tendancies.
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Post by Nomoregraves on Jul 4, 2017 19:28:09 GMT -5
Jim Cunningham took his own like with a hand gun on the Golf course; October 2nd. Where Donnie wakes up on the first night.
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) but they cant work out the details like names.