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Post by laggerific on Oct 5, 2004 22:30:48 GMT -5
So...who is gretchen and what is her real name? Is there significance there? Is she somehow related to Roberta Sparrow? Did Frank work out a deal with Gretchen as manipulated dead to be the only one to communicate "directly" with Donnie?
Where is the fan fiction?
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Post by laggerific on Oct 5, 2004 22:35:23 GMT -5
I meant where is the fan fiction in general...not just related to gretchen...although I think that would be fascinating to explore.
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Post by Twitchmonkey on Oct 5, 2004 23:00:31 GMT -5
So...who is gretchen and what is her real name? Is there significance there? Is she somehow related to Roberta Sparrow? Did Frank work out a deal with Gretchen as manipulated dead to be the only one to communicate "directly" with Donnie? Where is the fan fiction? 1. No one knows 2. I guess no one knows that either 3. Probably not 4. Per....haps though I cant see what the motive would be 5. You can access a pretty big fan fiction archive at bored.com which includes some decent DD stories |
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Post by ProvidencePortal on Oct 6, 2004 10:17:12 GMT -5
So...who is gretchen and what is her real name? Is there significance there? Again, great question -- and one about which I'd like to hear your thoughts ... especially because this is relatively unexplored territory. It's probably easy to dismiss the scribblings in the back of the book as additions by Kelly meant to better tie the generalizations made in the PoTT to the specific characters of the movie -- just in case any of us didn't get it. But, in the spirt of this forum's search for answers within the mythos, I'd like to talk about the writing therein. So, I'll start by asking, who are the likely scribblers? Roberta, of course. The teacher who gave the book to Donnie. Donnie himself. Frank, maybe, through some ethereal influence? (Feels unlikely.) I believe it must be someone who understands AND believes the stuff layed out in the book. Here's a quick stab (in the eye?) at a list of people and motivations, in order of most to least likely to have written those notes: Sparrow -- Had, it appears, been living her life for the moment when she would influence Donnie to transfer the Artifact back to the PU. It certainly seems possible that she either had flashes of foresight (and so had made those notes in the past, before the rift appeared) or quickly identified the players and roles in the TU once things were set in motion. Donnie's teacher -- Going by the "path of God" discussion, at least appears to buy into the sentiments behind the PoTT, if not the exact LR process it defines. If they're his notes, that's a whole higher plane of awareness than most MLs have ... but we do have evidence of their growing awareness based on another conversation he has: "Donnie Darko." "I know." Donnie Had the book and explored it completely. Probably understood his role, Frank's, as well as the general idea that the people around him were the ML. But, any chance he knew Gretchen was MD -- at least, any chance he could have known that before she was killed? (Could be that he wrote those notes just before going to the mountaintop to rip the engine from the plane ...) Ultimately, whatever the answer there, it seems unlikely he would have known that "Gretchen" was not her real name. So, there's the beginning of some footwork. Who wants to continue? |
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Post by Twitchmonkey on Oct 6, 2004 15:57:56 GMT -5
Well I would say that there is little doubt that Donnie knew that Gretchen wasnt here real name because of the conversation they had when the school was flooded:
"He stabbed my mother in the chest 4 times"
"Oh"
"We had to change our names and I thought Gretchen Ross as pretty cool"
Sorry if I screwed it up but the conversation slips my mind at the moment
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Post by rightfielder21 on Oct 6, 2004 16:17:12 GMT -5
Well I would say that there is little doubt that Donnie knew that Gretchen wasnt here real name because of the conversation they had when the school was flooded: "He stabbed my mother in the chest 4 times" "Oh" "We had to change our names and I thought Gretchen Ross as pretty cool" Sorry if I screwed it up but the conversation slips my mind at the moment That's pretty close... |
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Post by rightfielder21 on Oct 6, 2004 16:19:24 GMT -5
Providence, nice work...
That being said, I think it was just an addition to help fans understand, who has what part...
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Post by rightfielder21 on Oct 6, 2004 16:36:53 GMT -5
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Post by ProvidencePortal on Oct 6, 2004 20:02:57 GMT -5
Twitch, excellent call on the conversation regarding "Gretchen" being forced to changer her name to escape her abusive father -- something I'd totally forgotten. Nice work.
RF: thanks. And yes, that's the page that's being discussed. Wish it had come out a little more legible ...
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Post by laggerific on Oct 6, 2004 22:21:04 GMT -5
My wife thinks that Gretchen is related to Sparrow somehow. But reading that conversation makes me wonder how it's anything more than what she just said. But, then why would it be noted in the book? Depending on who wrote the notes, they could just want to note that in case it is relevant. Which makes me think it would have to be either Donnie or the Prof.
Sparrow would have to have written it awhile ago, unless I missed when he mentioned how he acquired it. I just picked up the DVD yesterday, but haven't had a chance to study it yet. When did the Prof get his copy?
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Post by Twitchmonkey on Oct 7, 2004 1:14:10 GMT -5
Well the way he mentioned it it seemed like she wrote it shortly after she started teaching at the school which was when she was pretty young so I'd assume the book was written before Gretchen or Donnie were even alive
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Post by ProvidencePortal on Oct 7, 2004 10:06:07 GMT -5
Yup -- the book had been written quite some time ago ... but I don't think that comes into play in determining when the handwritten notes were scribbled into the back pages.
Good question about when/how the teacher got his copy ... is there any suggestive evidence, anyone?
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Post by gretchen on Oct 7, 2004 17:54:28 GMT -5
i'd love to offer insight on this but... i really just don't know.
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Post by rightfielder21 on Oct 7, 2004 18:08:47 GMT -5
It could not have been Donnie, because it has Jim Cunningham's deathdate, which was after Donnie's in the Primary Universe...
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Post by Twitchmonkey on Oct 7, 2004 18:25:20 GMT -5
I personally think that there was only one copy and it was either a gift from one science teacher to another or perhaps Sparrow just gave it to him because she knew that he would give it to Donnie
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